Problem multilanguage products

[Studio 42]

uhm, usually not necessary. I wonder anyway, why you do not want to work with the fallback, which makes it a lot more commod. Btw, we have even a doubled fallback. For example,... pt-PT to pt-BR, when pt-BR not available use en-GB

I mean it's because you don't have such real situations.
Suppose you have some products only in one language and all this are in sub categories(because this exist only in one language, Different SKU, or you want classify this another way or use another template or you want use this as filter ...), then you have empty trees of categories for each language.

[Milbo]

You did not get my question. The question is why you have products only in one language and why you do not want that the product is seen in other languages?
Language is not country. From my point of view, it is wrong to use the language for filters. So I ask why they think they need that in their real situation.

[Studio 42]

Suppose you solde books, user guide is only in some language, Electronic tools using voice ...
It's perhaps not the best solution, but work.

[Milbo]

Yeh and in that case, I see as german the whole amazon shop in german, but the article in english. This is what I mean, you cannot use the language in our world to determine the shoppergroup. Maybe the german want to buy the english book. Maybe there is a french in germany and wants to buy something in english, who knows nowadays?

[GJC Web Design]

Can only agree, as a New Zealander  speaking Eng and German, living in a French speaking part of Belgium, I really hate sites that try to pre guess what I want --
be it lang, currency etc etc..
Why is there this drive to try and automate everything in life?

[Studio 42]

It's the only way for now to filter something depending on the language.
I know another solution is to display all product in all language, but why you mean you are right ?
I explained many time, to some customer is bad to do something, but i don't impose anything at the moment it's legal.
On restrict all, at the end you have all shop displaying all the same way, same design, same price ...

I think you should not remove existing features because you don't use it or only if this is a real blocker.
Joomla do the same and i think you hate this too ? Because this can full break all your work, on a simple update.

[Milbo]

The reason we kept it for products. If people want it also for category, they should provide a patch or pay someone to write a patch. I have no problem to add it.

[Studio 42]

The reason we kept it for products. If people want it also for category, they should provide a patch or pay someone to write a patch. I have no problem to add it.

This was working before. It's your own change that removed old features,  you know that some shop using it, so why you don't checked for this before adding your patch for language fallback?

[Milbo]

Patrick, it was never a feature. It was just bad written.

Before you had to store the product in any language, which is selectable in your shop.
That meant that 4 languages automatically lead to 4 entries. It also meant, that a shopowner has to store the product 4 times, before he can publish it, else it can happen that a shoppers reads about a product in english, changes languages to french and the product is gone.

Now it is so, that the products are loaded by the product table, not the language product table. The product is displayed in the selected language, if not available, it is displayed in the main shop language.

and we even have now the fallback of fallback. Example,
main language english
second language spanish
third language portugese


If the product is only in english, it is in english for any language. Lets assume the customer selects portugese, then the products appear in english, spanish and portugese. If the products has no portugese entry, but spanish entry, it will be displayed in spanish. and if there is no spanish, it will be displayed in english.

I agreed to add the old "possibility" to the new code, because I know that some people learnt to deal with it. But usually you do not have this for categories, because you have less categories than products.


And now back to the question. When I browse an english shop in german language, I want to see ANY product which can be sent to germany. Not only just the translated products. Is it so evil, when you see suddenly a product in another language? uuhmmm I could imagine that a FN store dont want to display anything in english, eh? :-), but they would write anything in french anyway.
Really I dont get the point here. Lets take another example

There is a pub and in the pub is no toilett, because the barkeeper says, it is always dirty, he dont want that his customers use such a dirty toilett, so it is closed.
I would just leave the pub.

Imagine, just because you do not speak spanish, you are not allowed to buy this or that product, and more crazy, just because the shopowner is lazy and did not translate.

it makes no sense and just makes customers upset.

[ste-jackson]

I am currently looking at creating a site which needs to have different products for different countries so in this example we will use french, so the English version will have everything abc.com/en and the French version needs to be tailored to the french market abc.com/fr what is the best way to achieve this for VM products.  As I see the above topic and am struggling to find better ways to do so.  We are trying to avoid the multi site option as that is how it is currently done.  The language controlling published products made sense a method for getting round this but I understand Milbo and the reasoning behind it but as a Virtuemart rookie I do not understand how to implement.  Any advice or guidance would be much appreciated to a better methodology than using language to filter products.

[Studio 42]

Hi Jackson,
The current answer is, don't do it, but we have no other solution to classify product needing different settings depending the language/country.
My opinion is to let the shop owner to have the last word, but apparently Max say, you have to follow my choice because it' s a bad way to do.
I know myself that the language is not the country, so in some case the solution is not the best, but i think in 90% of case this works well for many shops.

[Milbo]

so the English version will have everything abc.com/en and the French version needs to be tailored to the french market abc.com/fr what is the best way to achieve this for VM products. 

I would use the geolocator http://extensions.virtuemart.net/shopper-order/orders/vm-localise-detail, extend it so, that it pushes people into shoppergroups and use shoppergroups with the products.
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[Milbo]

but apparently Max say, you have to follow my choice because it' s a bad way to do.

Why do you lie so often.

The reason we kept it for products. If people want it also for category, they should provide a patch or pay someone to write a patch. I have no problem to add it.

Says that no one has to follow my choice. And it is typically for you, that I solve something (which you actually were not able to solve it, remind, you wrote the sql for and it was always meant with fallback!) and you cannot accept that.

Despite you insist that the "old" shit should still work, just because there are 10 users of more than 10 000 who wanna use it. but there are more than 1000s who want to use the fallbacks.

It would be really good for you and would also bring you more customers, if you would stop to blame me all the time. It is just ridicolous.

[Studio 42]

Max, you give me the reason why you want it so,
I don't manage the project, so i cannot say that it 's my choice.
You say 10 users?  But i have already more then 10 using my tools requested me how to add or remove translation in VM core because they won't mix english and other language in same views(because it's unprofessional or they don't want display the product ...) and yes, i have other vm user that need fallback to english.
And yes, it's a great feature to have fallback. So thank you for this.
And i can only blame one person, because you are the only one having the last word. Or please give me someone other that manage the project, i'm happy to discuss about this with him.

[Milbo]

as I said above, you can easily write a patch, which does the same for categories as for products, and then for manufacturers and media and so on.